If you have recessed cans for lighting in your home or office and need to replace the bulbs, you may discover that there are several options to choose from. If you want to light a more specific area, for instance, you might choose a PAR shaped bulb, which more sharply focuses its light. But for the sake of this article, we’ll discuss the two bulbs most commonly used in recessed cans for general lighting: BR30 and BR40. We’ll also talk briefly about the pros and cons of choosing LED bulbs, as well as an LED alternative you can consider. The Shapes: BR30 and BR40![]() Let’s start by understanding the terminology. In the names of these bulbs, BR refers to a bulged reflector; this shape is used to evenly spread light, which is why these are used for general lighting. The 30 and 40 refer to the size of the bulb in 1/8 inches -- 30/8 and 40/8 inches respectively. Or more simply, the BR30 is just under 4" across and the BR40 is 5" across. So when you're choosing a bulb for recessed cans, the first thing to know is the size of the cans. For general lighting, most cans are 4" or 5" or 6". For 4" cans, you cannot choose BR40 bulbs -- they're too big. For 5" cans, a BR30 will fit with a little space to all sides while a BR40 will fit with little to no space on the sides. For 6" cans, a BR30 may leave so much space between the bulb and trim that you don't care for the look, though this is a personal choice. General Usage![]() Ceiling height is another traditional consideration when choosing your bulb; BR30s are often used on lower ceilings with BR40s on higher ceilings. If the bulbs are equal in wattage, this may not make much of a practical difference; but BR40s commonly come in higher wattage options, helping them spread light across a room from that greater height. Arguably, with the same beam angle but a wider lens, BR40s spread light a little more widely than BR30s. This could affect your bulb selection based on purpose of the lighting and distance between the cans. But practically, this is likely to be a subtle difference, and we recommend choosing primarily for wattage (or lumen output) and the size of the cans. LED vs IncandescentNow that we understand the uses of BR30 vs BR40 bulbs, let's talk about the pros and cons of choosing LEDs for your light bulbs. The big claim to fame for LED lighting is that it operates on far less energy to produce lighting equal to an incandescent or halogen bulb. This means it costs a lot less to run and, at today's LED prices, an LED replacing a frequently used incandescent bulb will often pay for itself in 1-2 years and then start putting money in your pocket for years to come. But the last push for energy efficient lighting with CFLs left a bad taste in many people's mouths -- yes, those bulbs saved money on electricity, but they had some drawbacks too. So we've spent a lot of time teaching about LEDs in detail, for instance in our Ultimate Guide to LEDs. But let's take a quick look here at how LEDs and incandescent bulbs compare: Similarities: Like incandescent bulbs, LEDs reach full brightness immediately. Both work well in a wide range of temperatures, and both are free of mercury. Lifespan: Some LEDs are only rated to last 5000 to 10,000 hours; many are rated to last 25,000 hours and more. Compare that to an incandescent rating of 1000 hours. Those who remember that CFLs didn't live up to their 10,000 hour claims, LEDs aren't affected by the same things like frequent on-off cycling or cold temperatures. So if LEDs are made of quality components, they should often last this long. Dimming: Incandescent bulbs are masters of dimming. Most LEDs also dim (check the packaging), but they need compatible dimmers. Otherwise you may run into flickering and buzzing. Some LEDs (like this BR30) get a warmer look when you dim them to mimic incandescent bulbs; again, look for this feature on packaging. Durability: As you know, incandescent bulbs are pretty delicate thanks to the glass bulb and the thin filament. Some cost more and come with a better supported filament and shatter resistant bulb. But LEDs -- which have plastic bulbs and no filament -- are durable from the start. Heat: As you also know, never unscrew an incandescent bulb that was recently turned on or you can burn your hand. LEDs stay cool the touch on the bulb portion, though their heat sinks toward the back get hot. Due to their need to dissipate heat, LEDs also need some air flow, so check the packaging for compatibility if you plan to use an LED in an enclosed fixture. Color Rendering: We perceive the colors of things differently depending on how the object is lit. This is because of the wavelengths present in the light. Incandescent bulbs are typically considered the best light bulbs for providing us with accurate colors, but LEDs do an excellent job as well, and as we've shown elsewhere, arguably render colors better. This is a matter of personal preference. Color Temperatures: This term refers to how warm or cool the bulb appears to the eye, and we measure this in Kelvins. 2700K to 3000K are considered warm colors, and look more yellow; 3500K to 4100K are neutral, fairly white in appearance; 5000K and above are considered cool, and look more blue. Incandescent bulbs are usually around 2700K, and even warmer when you dim them. Many LEDs can appear 2700K as well, and as we've mentioned, some warm as they dim as well. But LEDs also offer a range of cooler color temperatures, giving you more flexibility in different settings. Some people, for instance, prefer neutral or cool color temperatures in kitchens and utility settings like laundry rooms. * * * * * So should you choose BR30 and BR40 LEDs over their incandescent brethren? If you're interested in saving money long term (and don't love changing light bulbs), the upgrade makes a lot of sense. But you can look at these other factors when considering what's right for you. An LED Cautionary Note:It may be tempting to look for the cheapest LED bulbs you can find when replacing incandescents. We encourage you to consider name brands, as they're not only likely to last longer, but also to better retain their light output (lumens) and color temperature. This is why Lighting Supply carries mostly name brands. We'd rather you get a good deal on something that's designed to provide you with a good experience. Downlight Retrofit Kits: an LED Alternate![]() If you've decided to upgrade your BR30s or BR40s to LED, the obvious choice is to replace them with BR30 or BR40 LED bulbs. But that's not your only option. LED downlight retrofit kits cost a little more, but they're almost as easy to install as a light bulb and they give a clean, flush look to your recessed cans, entirely covering the open space. These also eliminate the choice between BR30 and BR40 shapes. Simply choose a kit to fit the size of the can and choose your lumens (light output) and color temperature and you're all set. You can check out the kits we carry here. As you can see, you have a few options when it comes to general lighting in recessed cans these days. We hope this explanation of bulb shapes and technology helps you to make the right buying decision for your needs.
42 Comments
Glenn Murray
8/11/2016 06:55:16 pm
Can I change my installed 2700 k downlight kit to a 3000 k or 3500 K ?
Reply
Steve
8/15/2016 09:48:46 am
Thanks for the question Glenn. If I understand your question correctly, you're just wondering if you can change the color temperature of your kits. This is just the visual appearance -- how "warm" or "cool" the lights look. So yes, if you buy new kits with a different color temperature, you can replace what you already have, presuming they fit the original recessed can.
Reply
A.J. Mesalic
8/24/2016 12:41:54 am
Nice help content. I'm finding myself preferring a BR40 LED lamp in a fixture that recommends BR30. The 40's are longer so they sit further down in the ceiling cans, thereby disbursing light to the sides better. It's a fairly tight fit but the 1/8 inch all around is all I really need. Hopefully these LED's will get ample air flow. They generate less heat than the old incandescent lights (and higher heat output) that the cans were rated for.
Reply
Steve
8/24/2016 08:07:06 am
Thanks for the feedback! Sounds like BR40s in a 5" can perhaps?That tight fit would give you a look more similar to the LED downlight kits -- a pretty flush appearance without the extra space. And great point about the lamp extending a bit further from the can so as to provide a better spread of light.
Reply
Jeff D'Ambrosio
10/16/2016 09:10:01 am
I put a BR40 LED in a 6 inch can and it seems to be too long. The bottom plate is adjustable with a wing nut but when I make it deeper to fit the BR 40 length it seems very flimsy and not centered when I screw it in? Any help?
Reply
Steve @ Lighting Supply
10/19/2016 09:52:31 am
Jeff, good question. As you point out, those base plates are adjustable, but as you extend the arm, it doesn't have quite the same strength. This isn't really an issue with incandescent / halogen BR40s, because those aren't very heavy. But an LED is much heavier, which is why you're getting that tilt.
Reply
2/1/2017 06:15:14 pm
Nice help content. I'm finding myself preferring a BR40 LED lamp in a fixture that recommends BR30. The 40's are longer so they sit further down in the ceiling cans, thereby disbursing light to the sides better. It's a fairly tight fit but the 1/8 inch all around is all I really need. Hopefully these LED's will get ample air flow. They generate less heat than the old incandescent lights (and higher heat output) that the cans were rated for.
Reply
Steve @ Lighting Supply
2/2/2017 08:02:48 am
Sounds like you're using a 5" can, which just barely fits a BR40. Most new cans are 4" or 6". A BR40 with a 5" can could certainly trap heat, although today's LEDs are no doubt better at managing heat than the earliest LEDs. Still, they do produce a lot at the base of the lamp. You may be fine if there's no insulation behind the can. If there is insulation, that will add to the amount of trapped heat, so you may find the life of the lights is reduced. We'd be interested to have you stop by and update this blog with a comment if you learn anything from your experience.
Reply
A.J. Mesalic
2/2/2017 02:32:29 pm
I've had a dozen of these installed like this for half a year and no issues at all so far.
Reply
Joanne R.
3/16/2017 08:15:47 pm
Thrilled to find such a clear and concise explanation of everything. We are so typical of those who tried to help the environment by switching to all CFLs in our house -- total nightmare, especially where dimmables and instant-on was required. Now we're moving to LEDs, and I have the same problem. Ordered a BR 30, but when I put it in the 5" can, it was set back so deep that it didn't look right aesthetically, and the light spread was reduced. So I'm planning on getting BR 40s, but am also worried about the heat. (I assume there is attic insulation). Anyone else have feedback on this issue? Thanks!
Reply
3/17/2017 11:37:46 am
Joanne, thanks for the comment. If you still have those BR30s, you might check the cans and see if you can adjust how far back the socket is set. It's possible you can move those BR30s forward. In any case, BR40s at a similar wattage shouldn't create that much more heat. If they're inside an open fixture, the air circulation should help to dissipate heat.
Reply
Marie Villere
12/29/2019 01:40:25 am
I have used extenders to lower the bulbs down in the can. They are about $2 at Home Depot. Drops the bulb down to cast more light. Looks great and works like a charm.
Reply
Susan B
10/15/2017 03:40:07 pm
Can I put a BR30 bulb outside under the garage eves. All sales people are giving me different info. Please help .....
Reply
10/16/2017 09:01:16 am
Hi Susan,
Reply
Bobby
11/3/2017 01:48:24 pm
Looking for dimmable LED BR40 bulbs to replace in bedroom can lights.
Reply
Steve @ Lighting Supply
11/3/2017 02:20:09 pm
Hi Bobby. Thanks for the question. A couple of thoughts:
Reply
Chris
11/17/2017 03:37:10 am
Excellent guide, very helpful! I did have one question, though. You stated:
Reply
Steve @ Lighting Supply
11/17/2017 10:09:50 am
Hi Chris. The numbers associated with these lights refers to the diameter of the face in 1/8". So a BR30 is supposed to be 3.75" across. Assuming some brand doesn't call it a BR30 and then build it differently, the answer is yes -- it should fit with an inner opening of 4", leaving minimal extra space.
Reply
Greg
11/28/2017 08:28:46 am
I’ve been using incandescent BR40s for the last few years in our kitchen and they go out all the time! I have a total of 8 lights and it seems like 1 is always out. Is this a common problem and would LED be a better option to try? Thanks for your help
Reply
Steve @ Lighting Supply
11/28/2017 09:43:54 am
Hi Greg. Yes, that sounds entirely normal. Incandescent bulbs are usually rated for around 1000 hours of use. At 3 hours of use a day on average, they're likely to go out about once a year. So when you have 8 bulbs in place, you'd average one light going out every 6 weeks or so. (Of course their outages could bunch up, but I think you see the point.)
Reply
11/30/2017 02:07:54 am
love this and needed night lighting under our counters, saw here another idea that you put tube lighting under counters near baseboards, so I used a string of lights under my island counter for night lights, and it's great, so thanks for the idea and all the ideas here are very helpful. :D
Reply
GAW
12/6/2017 01:02:16 pm
I have 12' ceilings in my kitchen. Currently I have 12 BR38 halogen lights, definitely in the warmer tones. They say flood but I think it is a narrow flood because I can see a shadow on the walls closer to the ceiling. They are on a Lutron switch installed 12 years ago.
Reply
Steve @ Lighting Supply
12/14/2017 10:09:43 am
This is an interesting question and shows how many variables are involved in picking the right lights!
Reply
12/18/2018 02:31:07 am
Superb Article. i know the post will be good and i am surprised that you wrote it|
Reply
Thomas
1/9/2019 01:03:19 pm
I had just remodeled my previous home and used Phillips Hue Color and white bulbs, so they were “Alexa” enabled and whole family loved using these. Just moved to a home with 14” ceilings that use 6” cans and BR40 bulbs. I was hoping I could do same thing (including color bulb options in certain rooms) all “Alexa” enabled and am having a hard time finding a solution, since Phillips doesn’t have color BR40 hue bulbs.
Reply
Steve
5/25/2019 10:27:36 am
Are there LED Downlight Retrofit Kits for sloped ceilings? I don't want the light to shine out at an angle; rather, I want the flood light to shine down.
Reply
Brittney @ Lighting Supply
5/31/2019 10:34:49 am
Hi Steve -
Reply
Douglas
8/14/2019 12:27:01 pm
I have 4 expensive BR40 LED bulbs that I want to put in my downstairs DEN that is too dark. However, the cans are 4 in cans and currently have BR30 bulbs.
Reply
Brittney @ Lighting Supply
9/18/2019 09:00:42 am
Hi Douglas,
Reply
greg
1/8/2020 12:48:51 am
i have 4" cans which use br30. i am able to get br40 led in them however, they tighten up all the way to the outer plate.will this cause no air cirulation inside the canister??
Reply
Brittney @ Lighting Supply
1/9/2020 11:17:31 am
Hi Greg,
Reply
Carol
4/27/2020 05:59:16 am
What LED lamp should I use in a kitchen for both perimeter and island lighting to adequately light the countertops? The contractor is installing 6” cans and the ceilings are 12’ high. I will be using under cabinet lighting also around the perimeter. PAR or BR? I am also looking for lamps with high CRI.
Reply
Brittney @ Lighting Supply
5/18/2020 10:12:06 am
Hi Carol -
Reply
Jay
5/19/2020 12:46:00 am
I've got a bit of an unusual situation (or maybe not). I have a number of recessed lights throughout my home that are difficult to get to due to 13 and 18 foot ceilings. A ladder will only get me so high, and the extension poles with the suction cups don't work for me.
Reply
sam
7/14/2020 03:20:47 pm
Hi I was wondering if one can use "Indoor Br30 by Philips" outside in exterior recessed lightings around the house? Will there be any consequences in using an indoor bulb outdoors? Thanks
Reply
Brittney @ Lighting Supply
7/21/2020 08:35:45 am
Hi Sam,
Reply
Robert
7/23/2020 10:22:11 am
Hi, for Hue white ambiance and white/color ambiance in 5/6 retrofits, which size can would be more suitable? 6" appear to be more widely avaialbe, but do the retrofit dowlights fit better in a 5 or 6" can?
Reply
Brittney @ Lighting Supply
7/27/2020 07:33:25 am
Hi Robert,
Reply
8/5/2020 03:07:50 am
i am installing more then half dozen but not facing any issue till now and really happy to see this blog. hope you add some more stuff like this in future also
Reply
Brittney @ Lighting Supply
8/6/2020 11:15:13 am
Hi Kimmy, happy to help! If you run into any further issues and have questions, please give our Customer Service Team a call at 877.231.2852.
Reply
JJ JOHNSON
9/6/2020 04:34:26 pm
I bought a 6-pk of Ecosmart 65W LED Indoor soft white BR30 dimmable bulbs for use in a “high ceiling” kitchen. I selected these mainly based on advertised life span of 22 years (25,000 hrs). However, after only 1-1.5 yrs of use, I’ve already replaced two bulbs because they started flickering. To avoid the “flickering” issue, I’m replacing these bulbs with Philips DurMax 65W Indoor BR30 Flood incandescent which obviously have a much shorter life span. Any advice/other options?
Reply
Brittney @ Lighting Supply
9/14/2020 12:59:23 pm
Hi there, JJ. Unfortunately, I cannot speak to the quality of the first brand purchased since we don't carry it at Lighting Supply. However, a few things that could affect the life of your bulb are the quality of product and the space left around the bulb in the canister. If the bulb fits too tightly, the heat cannot escape as easily and will shorten the life of the lamp.
Reply
Your comment will be posted after it is approved.
Leave a Reply. |